tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post553208384291909357..comments2023-09-28T08:13:11.489-07:00Comments on Only In It For The Gold: Peak CoalMichael Tobishttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08229460438349093944noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-58936913318467140782008-07-11T22:50:00.000-07:002008-07-11T22:50:00.000-07:00Eli:The issue with Britain and coal in the 70s was...Eli:<BR/>The issue with Britain and coal in the 70s was more the power of the mining unions, under-investment in a nationalized industry, the availability of natural gas, foreign exchange rates and the cost of mining coal in some of coal fields. Depth was not a major issue per se, non continuous seams plus depth was. The Yorkshire mines were particularly hard hit by these realities.berniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17098622568174375997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-19129121049770103832008-07-11T17:19:00.000-07:002008-07-11T17:19:00.000-07:00What about oil shale, peat, etc all that stuff tha...What about oil shale, peat, etc all that stuff that gets more economical to extract as the cost of energy grows... and of course produces a lot of CO2 in electricity generation too.<BR/><BR/>I love it how people extrapolate from "coal to oil" that an "oil to future fantasy energy source" is a certainty.<BR/><BR/>I wonder what current civilization would be like if there weren't great oil reserves for some weird geochemical reason.<BR/><BR/>Would nuclear power have been invented earlier? Or would we be much further behind on practically everything technical? I lean towards the latter...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-47759097746401692292008-07-11T16:39:00.000-07:002008-07-11T16:39:00.000-07:00And, of course, David Rutledge offers the same opi...And, of course, David Rutledge offers the same opion about the world's supply of coal. He stated that reserves are seriously overestimated; the world experiences peak coal in about 2025 CE.<BR/><BR/>On TheOilDrum his article even does an IPCC type projection, coming in much below even the lowest of the IPCC ones. Do to peak coal.David B. Bensonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02917182411282836875noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-66464702935310185952008-07-11T10:58:00.000-07:002008-07-11T10:58:00.000-07:00duffandnonsense says: And as oil becomes scarce, w...duffandnonsense says: <I>And as oil becomes scarce, which it isn't yet, then along will come another energy source.</I><BR/><BR/><A HREF="" REL="nofollow">21st Century Energy: Some sobering thoughts<BR/><BR/>"Transition to new energy sources is unavoidable, but here are five sobering first principles to remember along the way...<BR/><BR/>An impartial examination of some basic principles reveals five factors that will make the transition to a non-fossil world far more difficult than is commonly realised. These are: the scale of the shift; the lower energy density of the replacement fuels; the substantially lower power density of renewable energy extraction; intermittency of renewable flows; and uneven distribution of renewable energy resources."<BR/><BR/>Vaclav Smil</A><BR/><BR/>Smil knows more about the history and economics of previous energy transitions than just about anyone. Approaches relying simply on "but look what smart little monkeys we are!" are likely going to be proved vapid. The scale and the short time-frame for <I>this</I> transition are going to put us to the test.tidalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08979480547719289608noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-57103783636688076142008-07-11T09:13:00.000-07:002008-07-11T09:13:00.000-07:00Is there anybody who thinks that any resource in c...Is there anybody who thinks that any resource in constant use lasts forever, and wasn't Jevons, to use an old Brit expression, simply stating 'the bleedin' obvious'?<BR/><BR/>But, hey-ho, along came oil!<BR/><BR/>And as oil becomes scarce, which it isn't yet, then along will come another energy source.<BR/><BR/>That's humans for you, cunning little critters!<BR/>David DuffAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-10310345715768941972008-07-11T06:43:00.000-07:002008-07-11T06:43:00.000-07:00Well, yeah, it wasn't...So the questions raised ar...Well, yeah, it wasn't...<BR/><BR/>So the questions raised are 1) what did he get wrong and 2) does the peak oil argument depend on the same mistakes?<BR/><BR/>The first thing he got wrong was the growth in the rate of UK coal use, actually. It stopped around 1910.<BR/><BR/>A second thing he got wrong was thinking nationally rather than internationally, presuming that no country, observing the British example, would be so foolish as to voluntarily export their fuel.<BR/><BR/>The latter mistake definitely doesn't apply to peak oil, though it's pretty interesting. (A throwback to mercantilism in a mid nineteenth century economist. Presumably his understanding of economics was incomplete.)<BR/><BR/>Past futurism is a topic worthy of more than casual investigation, I think. As far as I know nobody has taken it up in earnest.Michael Tobishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08229460438349093944noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-62270139752762357172008-07-11T06:39:00.000-07:002008-07-11T06:39:00.000-07:00With respect to the UK, that pretty much happened,...With respect to the UK, that pretty much happened, the mines went deeper and deeper, and pretty soon the cost of getting the coal came close to the value. <BR/><BR/>See Thatcher, Margret and the coal unions. The cost of getting the coal was already a big problem in the 1970s.EliRabetthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07957002964638398767noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8524070301101240472.post-79838524368788300412008-07-10T21:31:00.000-07:002008-07-10T21:31:00.000-07:00Yes, it was a horrible day in 1961 when we ran out...Yes, it was a horrible day in 1961 when we ran out of coal.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com